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Baughman

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Reply with quote  #1 
New to the quad world been riding dirt bikes for years and thought I would give 4 wheels a try. I want to do a full check up on everything before I take it out of the trails. I plan on replacing the cam chain but I wanted to check the valves before I take it all down. I have the T mark on the flywheel aligned with the notch on the inspection hole, the dots on the cam are at 12 and 9 o'clock, piston is at the top of the cylinder and the lobes are facing outward. The exhaust is at .014 but I cant even get my thinnest gauge .0015 in on the intake side. Any tips? BTW its an 03
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2003 Predator 500
1996 Goldwing SE
2012 Harley Davidson FLHX Street Glide
1995 Celebrity 190 boat
hecsz28

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Reply with quote  #2 
Welcome!

When I checked my valves a few months ago I had the same thing happen. Couldn't fit the .0015 in the intake sides. I tried to re-shim them and still couldn't get any blades in there. If you can't re-shim them to spec, you may have to replace the intake valves like I did.

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Hector

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Baughman

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Reply with quote  #3 
Hope I don't have to tear into the valves. I am waiting on my new timing chain to come in. I will set the timing with the new chain and recheck it then go to a thinner shim and hopefully get a baseline to get it in spec. Did you have to have any machine work done on the head with the new valves or just drop in a new pair and lap them?
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2003 Predator 500
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2012 Harley Davidson FLHX Street Glide
1995 Celebrity 190 boat
Thelane

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Reply with quote  #4 
It depends on what your valve seats look like. you may just have to drop new valves in.

No matter what though if you are finding that you cant get in spec with even the smallest shims you will have to replace your valves (while youre in there its also very good idea to replace your springs)

If your seats are worn to where there is no longer a smooth taper you will need to send your head off

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**Lane Lariviere** (618)

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Thank you to my sponsors: Go Pro Cameras, Amsoil, Lone Star Racing, DWT, Motoworks, Spy Optics, ATV Powersports, We All Ride Clothing, Leatt Braces, ODI Grips, Polarisproriders.com
hecsz28

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Reply with quote  #5 
Thankfully for me, I didn't need any head work done. The seats were fine, it was just the valves that were worn down and i just lapped them in.(first time doing that)
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Hector

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Baughman

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Reply with quote  #6 
Going to try using a smaller shim and see if I can go from there. Currently has a .065 shim on both intake valves. Thanks for the advice, if I have to get into the valves I will probably be back with more questions!
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LEOGM5150

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Reply with quote  #7 
we will be happy to help.
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FROM: POWELL WYOMING USA

MY GREATEST FEAR IS THAT WHEN I DIE MY WIFE WILL SELL MY TOYS FOR WHAT I TOLD HER I HAVE INTO THEM...

2014 POLARIS RZR 4 900 EPS
2012 POLARIS RZR 4 900 XP
2008 POLARIS RZR 800
2008 POLARIS OUTLAW 525S LE
2007 POLARIS OUTLAW 525 IRS
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Baughman

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Reply with quote  #8 
New timing chain is installed and the timing is dead on. As expected intake is still tight, my Hot Cams shims should be here by the weekend.
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1995 Celebrity 190 boat
Baughman

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Reply with quote  #9 
Valves shimmed up good with a 1.45 and 1.50. The new timing chain fixed the top end chatter sound. Started tearing down the front end today A-arm bushings are caked up with old grease!! Thanks for the help
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Reply with quote  #10 
sweet you should be good in no time at all.
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FROM: POWELL WYOMING USA

MY GREATEST FEAR IS THAT WHEN I DIE MY WIFE WILL SELL MY TOYS FOR WHAT I TOLD HER I HAVE INTO THEM...

2014 POLARIS RZR 4 900 EPS
2012 POLARIS RZR 4 900 XP
2008 POLARIS RZR 800
2008 POLARIS OUTLAW 525S LE
2007 POLARIS OUTLAW 525 IRS
2000 400 RCR TWO STROKE SCRAMBLER
2001 400 TWO STROKE SCRAMBLER
2005 SKI DOO 1000 TWO STROKE SAND SLED
Ridz90

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Reply with quote  #11 
Baughman, how hard was the timing chain to change? I'm STILL to get round to this. Had such a nightmare with work that all luxuries have been put on hold. I have the chain and a shim kit for the valves, just wondering how hard it was to do the chain?

Scott
Dunph

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Reply with quote  #12 
its really not that hard. it does take some time and a torque wrench, but with the help of this site i think it can be done by anyone. there is a dvd for sale that i have heard makes it very easy. ask leo for a copy
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Ridz90

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Reply with quote  #13 
Haha....I have to admit, I've already got the DVD! I cant imagine it will be too hard, but it's the thought of it more than the task itself I think. 

Do you need a pneumatic torque gun or do you just require a usual torque wrench? I've got some parts on order coming this week, so I may tackle it once those arrive and I have to actually carry out some work!
dn69141

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Reply with quote  #14 
I've also been reading and following this post! I'm about to go down the exact same road. I know I at least need shims, most likely replacing the intake valves at least installing a new cam chain. This post as well as others have been very informative! Today I got my shims in, the dvd ordered, and maybe by this weekend I'll tear into it and see what I can mess up!
Baughman

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Reply with quote  #15 
Yea it was really easy to change. I have been wrenching on my own toys since I stared riding about 12 years and have avoided getting into a four stroke top end all 12 years. Just stick to the manual and read up on some of the post on here and you should be fine. The hardest part was getting the tensioner back on. I had to take it completely out to get the new chain slack enough to fit over the cams. You have to turn the screw to get the plunger back enough to get the bolts started, kinda tight with only two hands. I also loosened the chain guide bolt next to the crank gear to get the chain to fit over the crank gear. You just need a standard torque wrench the "click" style work best but you can do it with a dial style too.

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2003 Predator 500
1996 Goldwing SE
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1995 Celebrity 190 boat
Ridz90

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Reply with quote  #16 
Thanks Baughman. This is all done while the bike is in neutral isnt it? Did you take apart the clutch basket and plates or did you remove it as a whole?
Baughman

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Reply with quote  #17 
I put it in gear and use a impact to pull the clutch nut. I pulled the pressure plate, all the plates, the inner hub then the basket separate but I guess you could keep the plates, inner hub and basket together .
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2003 Predator 500
1996 Goldwing SE
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1995 Celebrity 190 boat
Ridz90

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Reply with quote  #18 
I presume you got the timing all lined up with the relevant markings, and then stuck it into 1st to remove the clutch assembly?
MrJokke

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Reply with quote  #19 
why are you taking clutch out if youre only replacing timing chain?
Ridz90

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Reply with quote  #20 
I believe you need to take the clutch basket out in order to get to the timing gear which the chain loops round.
MrJokke

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Reply with quote  #21 
No need for that, once you have cams out of the head the timing chain gets so loose that you can just slide the lower timing gear out.
Ridz90

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Reply with quote  #22 
Is that possible? I thought once the tensioner was loosened, the chain would hang down enough to get it off the lower gear but it was in behind the clutch basket assembly? Thats how the DVD looks anyway
MrJokke

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Reply with quote  #23 
i have 3rd timing chain spinning now and ive never taken the clutch out, i have 05+ predator engine.
It may look like it in the pictures/videos because the clutch gear is in front of the lower timing gear?
Ridz90

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Reply with quote  #24 
Yup, thats how it looks to me in he DVD?

So if you don't mind, would you just summarize how you do it in a few lines?
Dunph

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Reply with quote  #25 
There shouldn't be a need to remove the basket unless the shifting linkage came loose
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Reply with quote  #26 
If the clutch basket doesn't need to be removed, then what's the easiest and best method of changing the chain?
MrJokke

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Reply with quote  #27 
Once you have marks lined at TDC, you have valve cover off and clutch cover too.
Loosen your tensioner with philips screw driver and put a wise grip to it so it holds the tensioner open/loose.
Unscrew the big nut what is in front of clutch gear(or was it oil pump gear?) and lower timing chain gear. Take the first gear off so you can see the timing gear.
Open the "something" what holds the cams, i dont know what its called.Take the cams out.
Now you  can take timing gear out and drop the chain and take it out from clutch cover side.

Put the new chain in repeating these things backwards and make sure your timing is right before and after you release the tensioner. 
Ridz90

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Reply with quote  #28 
Well there you go! I was sure the clutch assembly had to come out but looks like I'm wrong. May finally attempt it this weekend then!!!
Ta2edphreak

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Reply with quote  #29 
I too am about to tackle shimming valves, my question is which is less expensive or the "right"choice. Do I have to order the whole shim kit, or can I buy a refill or do I go to the dealer to get shims or what? The 2003 predator 500 is my first quad, I have a very competent family friend doing the work with me "helping" and I am going to order the Clymer book for it on Friday.
redpred

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Reply with quote  #30 
u can go buy shims from the dealer or u can order the whole shim kit up too u.........
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Ta2edphreak

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Reply with quote  #31 
Are the individual shims somerhing the dealer would have in stock?
redpred

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Reply with quote  #32 
yes 
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Ridz90

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Reply with quote  #33 
For the cam/timing chain change I presume the oil needs to be dropped fully and the engine cold?
MrJokke

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Reply with quote  #34 
yes thats right.
dn69141

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Reply with quote  #35 
The plugs on the stator cover, what size bits/allen wrench (?) do them take? Looking at the service manual I'm pretty sure I'm reading the wrong ones. I know they are metric and I have to go get a metric set because I cannot find mine anywhere. I'm guessing they aren't "plugs" but they actually screw in and out?
MrJokke

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Reply with quote  #36 
Yup allen "screws".
smaller is 6mm and bigger one is 8 or 10mm.
dn69141

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Reply with quote  #37 
ahh its a 10.. thanks. The service manual said 32mm and 14.. i knew that was wrong!
Ta2edphreak

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Reply with quote  #38 
Went to fiddle around with mine today, I tried a new plug for giggles, and it seemed like there was a ton of water in the cylinder when turning it over, it wasn't coolant it was just water. Is this also a sign of valves? Or something different?
LEOGM5150

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Reply with quote  #39 
that is a sign of someone poured water in your tail pipe or in the spark plug hole. if you run coolant in your radiator there is no reason for water to be in your machine at all. not sure what that is from other than vandalism or a side ways rain storm.
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FROM: POWELL WYOMING USA

MY GREATEST FEAR IS THAT WHEN I DIE MY WIFE WILL SELL MY TOYS FOR WHAT I TOLD HER I HAVE INTO THEM...

2014 POLARIS RZR 4 900 EPS
2012 POLARIS RZR 4 900 XP
2008 POLARIS RZR 800
2008 POLARIS OUTLAW 525S LE
2007 POLARIS OUTLAW 525 IRS
2000 400 RCR TWO STROKE SCRAMBLER
2001 400 TWO STROKE SCRAMBLER
2005 SKI DOO 1000 TWO STROKE SAND SLED
dn69141

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Reply with quote  #40 
Should I get a new side cover gasket or can you usually reuse them? I am just asking because I'm sure it'll take all week to get here so I better order one today if I need to. I never got the side cover off, but I got to where all bolts are loose and oil drained.

Good news at least! I think my shims for now did the trick.. we will see when I finally get it put together.
Baughman

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Reply with quote  #41 
Sorry for the bad info on the clutch basket, I got a little excited when I pulled the side cover and just pulled it off to make more room. I also wanted to check the condition of the clutch components. I reused my gasket and no leaks yet but it might be a good idea to replace it.
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2003 Predator 500
1996 Goldwing SE
2012 Harley Davidson FLHX Street Glide
1995 Celebrity 190 boat
Pred03 500

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Reply with quote  #42 
Can anyone please tell me how I can find the correct shim size? To explain how the original size wasn’t recorded. Took head to local shop to have valve replaced (not all just two). While all of repairs were being performed the shims had gotten mixed up. So now I’m stuck. I have service manual and got the shims as for per service manual. Now the feeler gauge records .11 for the exhaust side- .008 for the intake side. Still no startup have fire to plug. I have checked TDC timing and timing marks top and bottom. Checked fuel to carburetor. What is strange I can spray a small bit of starter fluid in carburetor and it still want try to start up. I have also went through two one-way starter clutches (one was pre-owned) trying to see if it would fire up. Can someone please tell me what I’m doing wrong been tackling this Predator 500 for months.

Thanks
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